Category: Media

credit score, employers, CBS4 Denver

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 9:56 AM
To: Rachel Lulay, CBS, National Amusements
Cc: Gloria Neal, award winning on-air talent, CBS4 Denver, National Amusements; Tim Wieland, news director, CBS4 Denver, National Amusements; Randy Fischer, state representative, Colorado; Randy Fischer, state representative, Colorado; Morgan Carroll, majority caucus chair, state senator, Colorado
Subject: credit score, employers, CBS4 Denver, National Amusements

See this message and your response at https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=3386.

You broadcast, “I was surprised to learn that a lot of companies already do look at credit scores when hiring.”

Your report is inaccurate.  The national consumer reporting agencies all state that they do not provide credit scores for employment screening.

On what day before the hearing will you broadcast a correction at the same time of day?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342

Suze Orman’s schtick

The consumer reporting agencies all state that they do not provide credit scores for employment purposes.

Suze Orman, “internationally acclaimed personal finance expert,” is on tour right now, and tonight, she has a spot on Real Time with Bill Maher [submit question].

Despite the fact that employers do not use credit scores (they cannot even get them), Orman keeps saying (and writing) that employers do use credit scares scores.  It must sell.

Tonight, will she use the same talking point, set the record straight, or neither?  Here are examples of the millionaire’s tour schtick.

Hosted by Allowed to bleat on unquestioned for almost four minutes by the media queen, herself, the expert bloviates, “Now, employers will not hire you unless you have a credit report and a good FICO score” (1:24). Orman gets a pass from the interviewer, Arianna Huffington.

In the article associated with the video, the Huffington Post, itself, says the same thing: “It can also affect their ability to rent an apartment and get a job, as many employers now check credit scores as part of the hiring process.”

Where are all the tough questions?  They just wind her up, and let her go.  Interviewed by an actual namesake–the publisher of ForbesWoman–an oddly agitated, seething Orman said, “And because they have a FICO score, a landlord will rent to them, an employer will hire them, their car insurance will be lower (especially if it’s a good FICO score)” (5:11).

She also said, “In my opinion, credit scoring is obsolete” (1:13) while her mug still sits on the FICO credit score website as she hawks credit scores.

Discussing her legacy (“I’m closer to 61, now, than I am 60.”), the prolific author proclaims to all the people, “I want to create a new scoring system.  I hope they call it the S.O. Score” (5:46).

Oh, brother.

And then (speaking of promoting oneself) there’s the SELF thing, itself.  It is easy to see why Orman would gush, “I love SELF Magazine.” The Condé Nast publication edited out the part about employers and scores.  But they left in the bit about “Suze Orman, the smartest woman about money in perhaps the world.”

Perhaps.

 

Groundhog Day, 2012: Wikipedia – Jimbo vs. Cookiehead

“Groundhog Day, 2012: Wikipedia” updates the previous year’s entry, Groundhog Day, 2011. 

In an exciting showdown, the guy most associated with Wikipedia, Jimmy Wales, has his contribution edited by a Wikipedian named Cookiehead.  Including “Jimbo,” himself, the rogue editor, the New York Times and the Connecticut legislature, 2012 documents the source of inaccurate information and how it is disseminated by a powerful, byzantine organization with a website.

 

Suze Orman’s social experiment

This train wreck is almost unbearable to watch.

Suze Orman, “internationally acclaimed personal finance expert,” is hustling her thing called the Approved Card.  But she doesn’t seem to know what kind of card it is.

The fabulous expert showed up in fabulous Manhattan to talk to Lucy Danziger, the fabulous editor of SELF, the fabulous magazine from the fabulous Condé Nast.  Danziger, who describes Orman as “the smartest woman about money in perhaps the world” asked, “Is this a credit card?”

Looking annoyed, Orman replied, “No!  It’s a debit card!”

Moments later, holding up the card for effect, she said, “It is possible that in 18 to 24 months from right here, a debit card will be deemed to generate a FICO score.”

As the chatterboxes signed off, Danziger said, “And, good luck with your credit card!”

Wagging her finger, Orman yelled, “Debit card!” and gave the camera a stupid look.

Danziger yelled back, Oprah-style, “Debit card!”

Orman hollered, Oprah-style, “Actually–my prepaid card!”

The yelling stopped as they realized what a mess they were making, and Danziger said, soberly, “Good luck with your prepaid debit card.”

Orman replied, deadpan, “No, just prepaid card.”

Ugh.

The worst thing about the interview, however, beyond the credit/debit/prepaid knuckleheadedness (or the bad audio– it isn’t your computer), is that the smartest woman about money in perhaps the world repeated this, now preposterous, urban legend:

“Employers are starting not to hire you if you don’t have a good credit report and a good credit score.”

The consumer reporting agencies do not provide credit scores for employment purposes.

Excellent journalist that she is, the editor just said, “Interesting,” swallowed it whole, and let the blowhard continue.

Su–ze — Or–man — just — won’t — shut — up — about it.

And, if you give her any guff, she’ll call you an idiot.

Bring it.

————————————————————————–

UPDATE 2/3/12

Here’s the new video, with the part about employers using credit scores (since they are not) edited out:

 

The Matrix: NBC, Reuters, Suze Orman, FICO and American Public Media

They did the dirty deed, spreading the big credit score urban legend.

Hardy har har.  There’s a tongue in cheek campaign to replace Suze Orman with Reuters’ tough Lauren “I demand a lot of answers” Young. But, in reality, it’s a perfect match.  That is, they both believe the same myth: that employers use credit scores.

Oh, those British and their dry wit.

 

credit score, employers, Chicago Tribune, 2012-01-13

[for background, see Two and Two: Credit scores fall, AP] 

From: Greg Fisher
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 8:08 AM
To: Marksjarvis, Gail
Subject: credit scores fall story, 15 to 25.5 percent

You wrote: “According to research released this month by Fair Isaac Corp., which produces FICO credit scores, about 25.5 percent of Americans have credit scores below 599 — a poor score that often interferes with their ability to get a car loan or even other credit cards. That’s far below the long-term average of 15 percent.”

From whom did you learn the 15 percent figure?

 

From: Marksjarvis, Gail
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 2:04 PM
To: greg@creditscoring.com
Subject: RE: credit scores fall story, 15 to 25.5 percent

Fair Isaac released a study about two weeks ago.

 

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 1:51 PM
To: Marksjarvis, Gail
Subject: RE: credit scores fall story, not from news release

FICO’s news release does not mention the 15 percent figure.

You make the same error as the Associated Press story regarding the 25.5% number. Actually, 25.5% are under 600, not 599.

Did you take your information from AP?

 

From: Marksjarvis, Gail
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 4:17 PM
To: ‘greg@creditscoring.com’
Subject: RE: credit scores fall story, not from news release

Is 15 percent wrong?

 

From: Greg Fisher
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 4:43 PM
To: Marksjarvis, Gail
Cc: Michael Lev, associate managing editor, business, Chicago Tribune
Subject: RE: credit scores fall story, unnamed sources

I don’t know; I didn’t do the research for the story.

This is the third request. Do you refuse to name your source? Or, did you just make up the number, yourself?

 

From: Greg Fisher
Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2010 1:13 PM
To: Marksjarvis, Gail
Cc: Michael Lev, associate managing editor, business, Chicago Tribune; Jane Hirt, managing editor, Chicago Tribune
Subject: RE: credit scores fall story, propagation

Your story just appeared on the Fresno Bee’s website.

Who is your source?

From: Greg Fisher
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2012 1:51 PM
To: Gail MarksJarvis, personal finance columnist, Chicago Tribune
Subject: credit score, employers, Chicago Tribune

You wrote, “Because employers and landlords have access to the scores, it can determine who gets an apartment or even a job.”

Who is your source regarding credit score use by employers?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342

 

Salon can’t spell, and errs on employers and credit scores

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2011 2:01 PM
To: John Warnock, chairman, Salon Media Group Inc.
Subject: credit score, employers, Salon, 2011-12-02

See this message and your response at https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=3062.

You published, “Your credit score affects everything from job offers to home loans — and the way it’s calculated is deeply flawed.”

Credit score use by employers is an urban legend.  The consumer reporting agencies do not provide credit scores for employment purposes.

Will you make a correction?

Also, you spelled Isaac wrong.

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342

[NEXT MESSAGE]

credit score, utilization ratio, Moneyland, Time Magazine, Time Warner Inc.

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Monday, December 19, 2011 2:54 PM
To: Jeffrey L. Bewkes, chairman of the board and CEO, Time Warner Inc.
Cc: Scott Medintz, editor, MoneyLand, Time Magazine; Scott Medintz, editor, MoneyLand, Time Magazine; Chris Farrell, economics editor, Marketplace Money, American Public Media; Ian R. Friendly, chair, Board of Trustees, Minnesota public Radio and executive vice president, chief operating officer, U.S. Retail, General Mills
Subject: RE: credit score, myth, proportion of balances, Time Warner Inc.

See this message and your response at https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=3051, https://blog.creditscoring.com/?cat=134 and https://blog.creditscoring.com/?tag=time-warner.

You published, “When it comes to your score, 30% consists of the amounts you owe in relation to your available credit — an equation called your utilization ratio.”

Either your source misled you or your math is off.  Who is your source regarding your claim of the 30 percent importance of the so-called “utilization ratio”?  It is, indeed, a myth.

Earlier this month, another journalist made a correction about the same issue.  However, he failed to provide the source for his original claim.  Peculiarly, even the article to which his story links calls it a myth.

And, who calls it “utilization ratio,” anyway?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342

[previous email attached]

Wikipedia’s Jimmy wales on myth about employers using credit scores

When the person most associated with Wikipedia edits a Wikipedia article, it’s news.  But, today, his side–the truth–is losing.  Here is what has happened, so far.

December 8.  Wikipedian user 168.103.203.229 adds “Employers look at a[SIC] applicants[SIC] credit score prior to offering a position for employment and has[SIC] stirred controversy in many states,” a bogus (if not, ungrammatical) claim.  It is the first and last entry by that user.

December 10. @creditscoring tweets “Christmas came early this year. https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=2997 So, #nowwhat, @jimmy_wales and #wikipedia?”

December 11. @jimmy_wales removes the inaccurate information.  The revision states, “rm unsourced controversial claim.”

December 12. Wikipedia user Cookiehead adds, “In 2009, TransUnion representatives testified before the Connecticut legislature about their practice of marketing credit score reports to employers for use in the hiring process.”

December 13. @creditscoring tweets “.@jimmy_wales TransUnion testifies on credit scores in employment. https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=3013.”

The link connects to a quote of a TransUnion official who (in 2009 and before the Connecticut legislature, no less) testified, “Now, credit scores aren’t used in employment decisions so let’s get that straight.”

 

The Wall Street Journal Sunday, Final response

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2011 3:25 PM
To: Alexa von Tobel, CEO & founder, LearnVest; Maria Lin, editor in chief, Learnvest, Inc.; Dani Dalesandro, Sunshine Sachs, press inquiries contact for LearnVest, Inc.
Cc: Ann Kaplan, chair of the board, LearnVest; Teri Everett, senior vice president, Corporate Affairs & Communications, News Corporation; Emily Glazer, reporter, Wall Street Journal, News Corporation
Subject: RE: credit score, utilization ratio, closing accounts, LearnVest, fabulous New York bunk

[FORWARD THIS MESSAGE TO LIBBY KANE]

Libby Kane, staff writer, LearnVest
740 Broadway, Suite 1002
New York, NY 10012

You wrote, “This ratio of how much credit you’re using to how much credit you could use accounts for about 30% of your credit score.”

That is a bunch of balderdash.

You also wrote, “When you close a card, you lose the credit history that went with it.”

That is pure poppycock.

Who are your sources?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342

[MESSAGES BELOW, AND PRIOR EMAIL, WERE ATTACHED] 

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 5:49 PM
To: Emily Glazer, reporter, Wall Street Journal
Cc: Ann Kaplan, chair of the board, LearnVest; Maria Lin, editor in chief, Learnvest, Inc.; Alexa von Tobel, CEO & founder, LearnVest; Melissa Rudy; Jennifer Waters, columnist, Consumer Confidential, MarketWatch, Wall Street Journal, News Corporation; John Ulzheimer, The Ulzheimer Group; Teri Everett, senior vice president, Corporate Affairs & Communications, News Corporation
Subject: RE: credit score, employers, Wall Street Journal, LearnVest II

What is your editor’s name?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342

From: Glazer, Emily
Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 4:59 PM
To: ‘greg@creditscoring.com’
Subject: Final response

Hi Greg,

I spoke with my editor and there will be no correction as I have confirmation from my source (who has also emailed you) about the accuracy of the information in the article. I believe I wrote this back to you, as did Alexa and people from LearnVest.

Thank you,

Emily

Emily Glazer | The Wall Street Journal Sunday
[address]
[phone] | [email address] | @emilyglazerwsj

The Wall Street Journal Sunday teams leading metropolitan newspapers with The Wall Street Journal in an authoritative and useful package of original investment news, personal-finance articles and career advice. (For recent stories check out: wsj.com/Sunday)

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Friday, June 10, 2011 12:51 PM
To: Alexa von Tobel, CEO & founder, LearnVest
Cc: Ann Kaplan, chair of the board, LearnVest; Maria Lin, editor in chief, Learnvest, Inc.; Emily Glazer, reporter, Wall Street Journal
Subject: RE: credit score, employers, Wall Street Journal, LearnVest II

When do you return?

[PRIOR EMAIL]