Experian | The Credit Score Blog

Duke tells students to revise history

From: Greg Fisher (greg@creditscoring.com)
Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2013 11:39 AM
To: Richard H. Brodhead, president, Duke University
Subject: RE: credit score, employers, myth, falsity, truth, efficacy of a social media message, ivory tower II, falsity

I do not see a reply to my email from you, and I am troubled that I have not noticed any that you might have made. But, the change that you made to your previously false document (if that is your response (and if it is not, then it is the greatest coincidence in history)) gives me, at least, a glimmer of hope for the future of the planet.

However, something else—something fundamental—troubles me even more. You state: “You can always ask a credit card company or other creditor to have negative information removed from your account. They want to keep their customers happy, so they will commonly oblige your request if you have regularly made your payments on time and just made a few errors.”

That is in your document—available worldwide—titled, “How can I improve my credit score?” and is the biggest crock of nonsense that I have ever heard. But I have heard it before and did what I could to stop it. After publicly following consumer reporting for 15 years, I have heard it all.

The law, the Fair Credit Reporting Act, states

The banking system is dependent upon fair and accurate credit reporting. Inaccurate credit reports directly impair the efficiency of the banking system, and unfair credit reporting methods undermine the public confidence which is essential to the continued functioning of the banking system.

It is no wonder the students and young alumni of Duke have an advantage: They have the power to change history.

I used the microcosm of the myth that employers use credit scores to determine the integrity of mainstream media. In that exercise of herding cats, I found that, largely, media organizations are passive-aggressive: They ignore their problem with accuracy, errors and corrections, and me. The First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution lives. The New York Times (the metaphor as well as the actual organization) needs no formal license to exist, publishes falsity (even about American history) and answers to no one. Now that that exhaustive (and exhausting) 5-year study of mine is over, as I crawl out of that rabbit hole of ridiculousness and into the light on the surface, I find ridiculousness ten-fold and growing.

But institutions of higher learning are not cats. They are (to use a fourth metaphor) a different animal, and, in some cases—as with public institutions, for instance—do, indeed, answer to higher authority. Although that appears not to be the case with you, your affiliation with a religious organization indicates a relationship to a higher moral authority, at least.

To whom Experian and its leaders ultimately answer in regard to misinformation, today, is confusing to me: Is it the Federal Trade Commission or Elizabeth Warren’s notion, the Bureau of Consumer Financial Protection (who likes to call itself the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau).

And so, since I have not seen a reply from you, I will now berate you with a prediction: You will change your website regarding that bunk about begging a creditor to create a history that never was, and, indeed, sir, suggesting that banks commonly lie to credit bureaus. It is heresy. Your outrageous suggestion impairs the efficiency of the banking system and undermines public confidence.

Have some dignity.

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
Page A2
pagea2.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio 45409-0342
937-681-3224

Truth, falsity and myth in the Ivory Tower

From: Greg Fisher (greg@creditscoring.com)
Sent: Monday, September 30, 2013 9:27 AM
To: Richard H. Brodhead, president, Duke University; Richard H. Brodhead, president, Duke University (via public affairs office); Irene Jasper, director, Student Lending, Duke University; Personal Finance@Duke, Duke University
Cc: Alex Rosenberg, Department of Philosophy, Duke University
Subject: credit score, employers, myth, falsity, truth, efficacy of a social media message, ivory tower

See this message and your response at https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=5408.

Your website states: “A poor credit score may mean having to make a large deposit in order to open an account with the electric company or to sign a new lease. It could even mean the loss of job opportunities.”

What is the name of the person who wrote that?

Experian claims, “Creditors, landlords, and even some employers consider a person’s credit score before deciding whether they will approve a loan, lease an apartment, or hire an applicant.” However, Experian also states, “No, Experian’s business policy prevents the inclusion of credit scores with an employment report, at Experian called Employment Insight.”

Employers do not use credit scores. I looked into it. See a five-year account of false statements (including yours, now), in this bizarre and fascinating phenomenon, documented at creditscoring.com. Apparently, you have not noticed the pages behind the links above. During your social media chat with Experian, will you address the notion regarding credit scores in employment alleged on your websites?

What evidence proves that employers use credit scores? What prompted the statement in your document? I am attempting to track the myth to its original source. Who provided—or how you came about—the misinformation is valuable.

Today, please acknowledge receiving this message.

There are many false statements; the one mentioned above has serious consequences. I believe that you and Experian have the burden to prove that your statements are true. Neither of you have provided any evidence.

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
Page A2
pagea2.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio 45409-0342

[next message]

Acknowledgement

Here is a list of steps to attempt to get the attention of people who misinform citizens.

1. Email
2. Social media message
3. Postcard
4. Letter
5. Certified letter, return reciept requested
6. Visit, in-person, whistle stop

Further steps (if necessary) might include cash, merciless berating and singing telegrams.

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2013 2:50 PM
To: José Quiñonez, executive director, Mission Asset Fund, and chairperson, Consumer Advisory Board, U.S. Consumer Financial Protection Bureau
Subject: The right thing

You wrote: “Experian, a major credit reporting agencies[SIC], estimates that 66 million Americans are unscoreable[SIC]—they do not have enough credit history to generate a credit score. And without a credit score, they can’t get loans to buy cars, start businesses, get mortgages, rent apartments, or even get jobs.”

However, Experian also states, “Employers never get a credit score.”

So, where did you get the idea that employers use credit scores?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio 45409-0342

Talk back to your screen

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2012 12:28 PM
To: Brian L. Roberts, chairman and CEO, Comcast Corporation (via Adam Miller, EVP, Corporate Affairs, NBCUniversal, Comcast)
Cc: Allen Wastler, managing editor, CNBC.com; Daniel Bukszpan, staff writer, CNBC.com, Comcast; Daniel Bukszpan, staff writer, CNBC.com, Comcast (2); Jennifer Dauble, director, public relations, CNBC; Bernard T. Gugar, Harpo Productions; Steve J. Bernas, president/CEO, Better Business Bureau of Chicago and Northern Illinois, Inc.; MSNBC.com; MSNBC.com (2)
Subject: RE: US national average credit score, “States with the best credit scores” II

Do you mean to tell me that you actually believe that the national average credit score could have decreased by 22 points in 11 days?

No way. Really?

On a recent whistle stop trip to New York (via Chicago), I was able to make a small dent in the misinformation about credit scores. However, these things have a life of their own, and I am not sure that Oprah Winfrey got my message (sent directly to her lawyer, however!). The inaccuracy on her website still exists. She even published this: “That history is digested by a company called Fair Isaac and converted into your credit score, which ranges from 350 to 800.”

Ha, ha!

That’s not true, of course, and it’s an old story. But, even the New York Times fell for Experian’s campaign, so don’t feel bad. Like the Times (until enlightened), you’re just in a Funk.

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio 45409-0342

[prevous message]

Contacting Oprah Winfrey, personal finance

The questions are all the same. Answers vary.

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2012 10:11 AM
To: Oprah Winfrey, Harpo Productions (via Bernard Gugar)
Subject: credit score, employers, Oprah Winfrey

See this message and your reply at https://blog.creditscoring.com/?cat=293 and https://blog.creditscoring.com/?tag=oprah-winfrey.

Your website states:

Last year, 25 billion credit decisions were made based on FICO scores alone. These weren’t just decisions about whether you’d be approved for a new credit card but… Whether an employer will hire you… In other words, your score is a really powerful piece of information.

I visited your office earlier this month, but was unable to see anyone about that statement.

Despite unfortunate conflicting information, employers do not use credit scores.

What indicates that employers base hiring decisions on credit scores?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio 45409-0342

reply, Hearst, media accuracy, erroneous reporting

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2012 10:26 AM
To: J.T. O’Donnell, columnist, J.T. & Dale Talk Jobs; J. T. O’Donnell, founder & president, CAREEREALISM
Cc: George R. Hearst, Jr., chairman, Hearst Corporation (via Lisa Bagley); William Dean Singleton, chairman, MediaNews Group, Inc.; Dale Dauten, columnist, J.T. & Dale Talk Jobs; Mary E. Junck, chairman, president and CEO; chairman, Executive Committee, Lee Enterprises; Mary Junck, Associated Press; Dale Quinn, reporter, Arizona Daily Star, Lee Enterprises
Subject: Re: media accuracy, errors and corrections, Lee Enterprises, Hearst, AP, a real joke

You must be joking about Lee Enterprises.

Experian states: “Experian’s Employment Insight report includes similar information about loans and credit cards that is listed in the credit report. It does not include year of birth, spouse reference, account number or credit score, which are irrelevant to hiring decisions”

I hope that’s official enough for you. Actually, a guy gave a testimony. He swore it, under oath even!

Finally, there is no longer anything on Equifax’s website about employers using credit scores.

So, that begs the question: Who is your source? And, if nobody said it in the first place, then what are you “validate/research” -ing?

On the other hand, Experian says, “Creditors, landlords, and even some employers consider a person’s credit score before deciding whether they will approve a loan, lease an apartment, or hire an applicant.”

Why don’t you tell that story?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio 45409-0342

From: [email address] On Behalf Of J.T. O’Donnell
Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2012 6:00 PM
To: greg@creditscoring.com
Subject: Re: media accuracy, errors and corrections, Lee Enterprises, Hearst, AP

Greg,

Just sent you a tweet but figured I’d email you too.

I hope you can understand that because you are the one emailing, we need to validate/research what you are saying.

I’ll circle back with you when I learn more.

Thanks for your patience,

[previous email]

Forbes’ attempt at hipness; Forbes’ correction policy

Ah, youth, and fabulous New York.

The “journalist,” “Interactive Editor,” and “web editor” now works for Reuters, who has it all figured out.

And if you think that’s rich…

[ORIGINAL MESSAGE]

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2011 11:43 PM
To: Heather Struck, reporter, Forbes; Heather Struck, reporter, Forbes
Subject: credit score, employers, Forbes, 2011-07-20

See this message and your response at https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=2274, https://blog.creditscoring.com/?cat=134 and https://blog.creditscoring.com/?tag=forbes.

You wrote

But one’s creditworthiness, as reflected in a FICO score or a credit report, now affects a lot more than the ability to borrow money or buy something on credit. It can affect whether you get a job, what you pay for insurance, and even how your personal relationships work out.

and

Employment consultants say a troubling credit score may cause hiring officers to more closely question an applicant. Vic Tanon, chief simplicity officer at Emplicity, an organization that consults in hiring practices across the U.S., says a bad credit rating is likely to be more of a factor in certain industries like financial services.

Who is your source regarding credit score use by employers?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio 45409-0342

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2011 3:10 PM
To: Vic Tannon, chief simplicity officer, CEO, founder and president, Emplicity
Cc: Heather Struck, reporter, Forbes; Heather Struck, reporter, Forbes; Monie Begley, Forbes
Subject: RE: credit score, employers, Forbes, 2011-07-20, Emplicity

Did you discuss the topic of credit scores with Forbes?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio 45409-0342

From: Struck, Heather
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2011 3:09 PM
To: Greg Fisher
Subject: Out of Office: credit score, employers, Forbes, 2011-07-20, Emplicity

I am out of the office at a Fellowship orientation until July 31. Please excuse my late replies to emails. If you need immediate assistance, please contact Tina Russo. [Russo’s email].

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2011 9:28 PM
To: Tina Russo, senior editor, Forbes
Subject: FW: credit score, employers, Forbes, 2011-07-20, Emplicity

—–Original Message—–
From: Struck, Heather
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2011 3:09 PM
To: Greg Fisher
Subject: Out of Office: credit score, employers, Forbes, 2011-07-20, Emplicity

I am out of the office at a Fellowship orientation until July 31. Please excuse my late replies to emails. If you need immediate assistance, please contact Tina Russo. [Russo’s email].

From: Struck, Heather
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 5:56 AM
To: greg@creditscoring.com
Subject: RE: credit score, employers, Forbes, 2011-07-20, Emplicity

Dear Greg,

My apologies for not responding to this until now. I am unsure if you spoke directly with him, but Vic Tannon was my source for that statement. Perhaps there is something you can add?

Heather Struck
Forbes
Markets, New York
[phone]
Follow me: http://blogs.forbes.com/people/hstruck/

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 7:43 AM
To: Heather Struck, reporter, Forbes
Cc: Monie Begley, Forbes; Tina Russo, senior editor, Forbes; Vic Tannon, chief simplicity officer, CEO, founder and president, Emplicity
Subject: RE: credit score, employers, Forbes, 2011-07-20, CRAs

The consumer reporting agencies do not provide credit scores for employment purposes.

What correction will you make?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio 45409-0342

From: Struck, Heather [mailto:HStruck@forbes.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 8:01 AM
To: greg@creditscoring.com
Cc: Begley, Monie; Russo, Tina; Vic Tannon, chief simplicity officer, CEO, founder and president, Emplicity
Subject: RE: credit score, employers, Forbes, 2011-07-20, CRAs

I understand your point, but it is very clearly sourced. The point there is some occupations have been known to look at credit scores in an evaluation, according to this source. I agree this point needs clarification, and you are very welcome to post a comment on the story.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/heatherstruck/2011/07/20/credit-score-fico-can-hurt-you/

Thanks for the note,

Heather Struck
Forbes
Markets, New York
[phone]
Follow me: http://blogs.forbes.com/people/hstruck/

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 1:12 PM
To: Heather Struck, reporter, Forbes
Cc: Monie Begley, Forbes; Tina Russo, senior editor, Forbes; Vic Tannon, chief simplicity officer, CEO, founder and president, Emplicity
Subject: RE: credit score, employers, Forbes, 2011-07-20, clarity

Only you mentioned clarification so there is nothing to agree upon.

According to consumer reporting agency TransUnion, a “rating” is the manner of payment of an individual account.

Who are your other sources?

What authority do you, as the writer, have in making corrections of errors of fact, or clarifications of unclear stories or attribution published by Forbes?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio 45409-0342

From: Struck, Heather
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 2:00 PM
To: greg@creditscoring.com
Subject: RE: credit score, employers, Forbes, 2011-07-20, clarity

My editor has authority to make corrections. You can be in touch with him if you like.

Matthew Schifrin – [email address]

Thanks –

Heather Struck
Forbes
Markets, New York
[phone]
Follow me: http://blogs.forbes.com/people/hstruck/

Experian claims employers consider credit scores for hiring

A long time ago, Experian, itself, stated, “Experian’s business policy prevents the inclusion of credit scores with an employment report, at Experian called Employment Insight.”

Today, however, Experian states, “Creditors, landlords, and even some employers consider a person’s credit score before deciding whether they will approve a loan, lease an apartment, or hire an applicant.”

That quotation is from ProtectMyID, a “part of Experian.”

In the United Kingdom, for that kind of monkey business, you are rewarded with knighthood.

And, with that, we have a new countdown.

MarketWatch, Dow Jones, News Corporation reporting on credit scores and employers

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Monday, March 05, 2012 6:33 PM
To: Rupert Murdoch, chairman and CEO, News Corporation (via Julie Henderson)
Cc: Melissa Rudy; Jennifer Waters, columnist, Consumer Confidential, MarketWatch, Wall Street Journal, News Corporation; David Callaway, editor-in-chief, MarketWatch, Wall Street Journal, Dow Jones, News Corporation; Lex Fenwick, CEO, Dow Jones, News Corporation (via Bethany Sherman)
Subject: RE: credit score, utilization ratio, Consumer Confidential, MarketWatch, Wall Street Journal, News Corporation, correction III, employers

You published:

Your credit score may be as important as your education and your job skills because it helps you navigate your lifestyle. It’s taken into account when you buy a house, a car or insurance, and when you seek credit for a small business. Increasingly, your score can help you land, or lose out on, a job, an apartment or utilities.

Employers do not use credit scores.

You quoted representatives from VantageScore, Credit.com and Experian. Experian states: “Experian’s Employment Insight report includes similar information about loans and credit cards that is listed in the credit report. It does not include year of birth, spouse reference, account number or credit score, which are irrelevant to hiring decisions.”

Credit.com claims, “One of the most prevalent credit myths is that employers use credit scores as part of their pre-employment screening processes.”

VantageScore told me that “employers use credit reports and not credit scores.”

If you still believe that your publication is accurate, then who is your organization’s source regarding credit score use by employers? And, this time, please be specific: What is the name of one person who said that employers use credit scores? If the source is a document, please identify it and quote it.

What is your correction policy?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio 45409-0342

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2011 10:15 AM
To: Jennifer Waters, columnist, Consumer Confidential, MarketWatch, Wall Street Journal, News Corporation
Cc: Melissa Rudy; Emily Glazer, reporter, Wall Street Journal, News Corporation; Teri Everett, senior vice president, Corporate Affairs & Communications, News Corporation
Subject: RE: credit score, utilization ratio, Consumer Confidential, MarketWatch, Wall Street Journal, News Corporation, correction II

a + b + c + d + .30 + f = .30

then the sum of… [previous email]

New Year’s Day: annualcreditreport.com

The Better Business Bureau indicates that the primary contact for AnnualCreditReport.com is David Vaughn.

A- is the BBB rating, and that is the same rating for Central Source LLC, the company whose telephone number is the same as AnnualCreditReport.com. The addresses associated with each of those identities are slightly different (PO Box 105281 vs. 105283).

The BBB states that Central Source LLC’s alternate business name is AnnualCreditReport.com. AnnualCreditReport.com’s alternate business name is Annual Credit Report Request Service, TransUnion.

There is no BBB listing for Annual Credit Report Request Service, TransUnion, however AnnualCreditReport.com is listed as an aka for TransUnion.

Managers listed by the State of Florida Department of State Division of Corporations for Central Source LLC are Kent Mast, John Blenke, and Jason Engel.