Discover Bank Discover Card

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 12:38 PM
To: David W. Nelms, chairman & CEO, Discover Bank
Subject: Your Credit Score and the Price You Pay for Credit disclosure, Discover Bank, distribution

See this message and your response at https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=4587.

Your disclosure titled, “Your Credit Score and the Price You Pay for Credit” states, “Scores range from a low of 300 to a high of 850.”

However, the next section of the document indicates that the scale is 341 to 850 (the bar graph of the distribution is captioned “FICO® Credit Score Range”).

That is illogical, but begs an illogical question.  What percentage of the credit scores in the population range from 300 to 340?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342

Myth in myths article

With regard to the so-called “utilization ratio,” common sense says More = Bad, and Less = Good, and the scoring model conforms to that intuitive notion.  But, here is another unfortunate case of misinformation; a syndicated error.

Recently, the bankrupt Tribune Company announced a new leader.  Perhaps this is a new beginning for errors and corrections.

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2013 11:53 AM
To: Gregory Karp, Tribune Newspapers (2) Cc: Beverly Harzog, credit card expert, author, and consumer advocate; Adam Levin, chairman, cofounder and expert, Credit.com
Subject: Myth in myths article

See this message and your response at https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=4582.

In “Credit scoring myths — and the facts,” You wrote: “Instead of looking at how much credit you have, scoring systems look at your ‘credit utilization,’ how much of your available credit you’re actually using at any given time. Credit experts are usually reluctant to say exactly what the ideal credit use is, but when pressed, [Credit.com chairman and co-founder Adam] Levin said it’s 10 percent, as ridiculous as that sounds.”

That statement is inaccurate.  According to Fair Isaac, the FICO score company, “Generally speaking, the higher your utilization rate is, the greater is the risk that you will default on a credit account within the next two years… That’s why it’s always good advice to keep your credit card balances low – the lower the better.”

Adam Levin’s own website even states (comprehensively, and with near-perfect symmetry), “The lower your ratio, the higher your score will be,” and “The higher the ratio, the lower your score will likely be.”

Avoid errors in your reporting by referring to “Credit score tips, information and guidelines for journalists/reporters.” See #3.

What is your editor’s name?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342

6/6/15 update: His response.

Lifehacker

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Friday, January 18, 2013 1:20 PM
To: Whitson Gordon, editor-in-chief, Lifehacker
Cc: Dan Gilbert
Subject: credit score, inquiries, one additional inquiry may not affect a score

See this message and your response at https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=4578.  This is a question about misinformation and the speed of its reproduction and at which it is eliminated.

You published, “Another conundrum in the credit world is that each time you apply for a credit card or a loan, you credit score takes a small hit.”

However, contradicting that claim, Fair Isaac, the FICO score company states, “For many people, one additional credit inquiry (voluntary and initiated by an application for credit) may not affect their FICO score at all.”

Your article is the first and most prominent one on your home page.  It is also near the top of a news search for the term credit score.

What indicates that each inquiry lowers a person’s credit score?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342

 

Florida Senate Committee on Commerce and Tourism

In Florida, the state legislature session is underway, and members are discussing the use of credit reports in employment.  Senator Nancy Detert is the introducer of Senate Bill 100, which was given 8 yeas and no nays this week.  The myth continues as the senator and media unknowingly push it.
Florida Poly

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2013 1:07 PM
To: Regan McCarthy, senior producer/assignment editor, WFSU-FM/ Florida Public Radio
Cc: Nancy C. Detert, chair, Committee on Commerce and Tourism, Florida Senate
Subject: Florida Senate Committee on Commerce and Tourism

See this message and your response at https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=4559.

You wrote: “‘ As we turn the corner on the economy and try to get people back to work, one of the stumbling blocks is that we have employers pulling credit reports and not hiring you because you have a bad credit score. And I think that’s frankly, kind of dirty pool, unless you’re dealing with money or trade secrets or a whole list of exceptions,’ Detert said.”

Employers do not use credit scores.

What is your clarification policy?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342

Florida SB 100, 2013

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 12:35 PM
To: Jim Turner, reporter, Sunshine State News
Subject: credit score, employers, Florida, SB 100

See this message and your response at https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=4554.

The Connecticut legislature was misinformed by its witnesses.  Employers do not use credit scores.

However, you wrote, “Proponents see the effort as a means to eliminate a Catch 22: You can’t improve your credit score because you don’t have a job, yet you can’t get a job because of your bad credit score.”

Who is your source regarding credit score use by employers?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342

 

Prediction: Dan Gilbert will make a correction.

Dan Gilbert will make a correction.  That is a prediciton that you can believe, sports fans.  Here’s why.

Gilbert is famous.  He’s a mortgage company, NBA basketball and casino squillionaire.  He is also infamous for a certain prediction about his basketball team.  And, unfortunately, his website, Quizzle.com, states, inaccurately, “Employers are Checking Credit Scores – Are You Ready?”

Employers do not use credit scores.  The credit bureaus state that they do not provide scores for employment purposes.

So, there are three things that @cavsdan can do:

  1. Name at least two employers who use credit scores, exposing them, so that the credit bureaus take serious action, and thus solving one of the greatest mass-media mysteries of the past decade: Just who these mystery employers are.  There are none, of course, so he is not going to do that.
  2. Sell his company before the pressure to make the correction is too great to ignore.
  3. Take his lumps and make a correction to the statement.

Follow the message to Dan Gilbert requesting the truth.

Adams Media, F+W Media book

Last Christmas, a broadsheet named the New York Times published an item about people using credit scores in dating.  In it was the claim, “The credit score, once a little-known metric derived from a complex formula that incorporates outstanding debt and payment histories, has become an increasingly important number used to bestow credit, determine housing and even distinguish between job candidates.”

The story quoted the book author (on something other than scores in employment) below.  But, even though the scary baloney that employers use credit scores has been “increasingly” rebuffed, it is obvious that it has not been countered enough.

Employers do not use credit scores.  Say that they do and you will end up here.  If you’re already here, you are hardly alone.

So, get over it. Just make a correction, and move on.

From: Greg Fisher
Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2013 11:44 AM
To: Manisha Thakor
Subject: Adams Media, F+W Media

See this message and your response at https://blog.creditscoring.com/?p=4523.

In your book “On My Own Two Feet” (2007), you wrote, “Increasingly, prospective employers are also looking at this three-digit number, under the assumption that people who are financially responsible make better employees.”

What indicates that, increasingly, employers use credit scores?

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342

[THE RESPONSE]

Aaron, are you up to the task?

This is a big mess.

In the ridiculous, ubiquitous, growing, and out-of-control worldwide discussion about credit scores, some know what they are talking about, and some don’t.

And some should.  Employers are not permitted to check credit scores.  At least that’s what it says (verbatim) on Credit.com.

Well, eventually that’s what it said.

However, recently, riffing on a silly (and inaccurate) story in a fabulously New Yorky newspaper, the actual chairman and co-founder of Credit.com appeared on something called the Daily Ticker.  The Ticker is a video thing, and has a studio and everything (here’s your 15 minutes of fame, Yahoo!)!  The rambling host said, “So we know it can affect whether or not you can get a loan–clearly, your credit score–or, even, to get a job–now, possibly, whether or not you can get a date or a second date maybe–more importantly–or a partner, for that matter.”

Phew.

That disjointed blather starts at 50 seconds into the video.  In response, the interviewee was silent regarding the interviewer’s inaccurate setup.  The guest didn’t bother to set the confused host straight.

Guilt by association?  Abso-flippin-lutely.  And lest you think that this is unfair to the guest–the guy from Credit.com–here are his words (verbatim) in a piece preceding the video screed on Yahoo!:

Apparently, the new normal involves both sides of the dating equation coughing up credit score information heretofore considered sacrosanct except in economic transactions. It’s no longer about getting a job, buying a house, car, cell phone or insurance, nor is it about renting an apartment, or anything else — and it’s not personal. Wait, I guess it is… According to several interviews conducted by the Times, if you don’t have the right score, you may well be shown the door.

Credit scores, relatively speaking, have not been around very long.  The FICO score was first seen in 1989, but consumers were not given direct access until 2001.  Bank accounts, however, have been around a few decades longer, but there doesn’t seem to be any trend for swapping bank statements on dates.

What’s more important: Your qualifications to take on more debt or how much money you have?

But, stop the virtual press!  Not only is the interviewer the host of that little video show, he is the actual editor-in-chief of Yahoo! Finance! (!)  Hokey smokes!  Now we’re getting somewhere! (!)  If he can’t make a correction, who can?

If only he–He, as He sits atop of the great Mount Yahoo!–gets the word, we can start to make some progress.  The efficacy of a social media message is in question.  But–hold on.  Hold on a cotton-pickin’ New York Times minute.  Maybe there is something better.  Yahoo (!) is using (!) an ancient, long-forgotten medium of communication (!) called “email” (!).  At the bottom of the story, it says: “We’d love to hear from you! Send us an email [!] at thedailyticker@yahoo.com.”

Yes, please send them email.  They’d just love it.  And social media messaging doesn’t work.

Terrible, terrible, terrible!  What’s the world coming to?  “Twitter.”  “Yahoo!”  “Times.”  With names like that, how seriously can you take this grand discussion?  But, hang on.  Just.  Another. Dad-blasted minute.  Dude.  This is different.  Think about it in terms of top-level domains.  Credit.com owns the word credit.

If, by the time you read this, the video disappears, don’t worry.  That delicious piece of nonsense has earned a place in the next employers/credit score video coming to a screen near you.

Yahoo!

Powerful.

Blithering.

Non-responsive.

Inaccurate.

But, the myth is not their fault.

Not almost 30 percent

“Keeping revolving credit low can have a positive impact on an individual’s credit score, since this accounts for almost 30 percent of a typical score.”  – A Fair Isaac press release, December, 2012

Let’s say we have 100 loaves of bread. There are two categories: Baked, and not yet baked (still dough).

There are 30 loaves in the baked category, and there are 6 types of loaves within that 30:

1   white
1   wheat
1   sourdough
1   French
25  rye
1   multigrain
------------
30  TOTAL

If we add the 70 loaves that are not yet baked, the total is 100.

1   white
1   wheat
1   sourdough
1   French
25  rye
1   multigrain
70  not yet baked
----------
100 TOTAL

Is it honest to say that almost 30 percent of the loaves are rye?

CFPB on checking your credit score at least once a year

From: Greg Fisher [mailto:greg@creditscoring.com]
Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2012 11:03 AM
To: Michelle Person, spokesperson, U.S. Consumer Financial Protection Bureau
Cc: Richard Cordray, director, U.S. Consumer Financial Protection Bureau (via press office); Mallory McLean, press assistant, U.S. Consumer Financial Protection Bureau; Moira Vahey, spokesperson, U.S. Consumer Financial Protection Bureau
Subject: RE: Who changed the name of our Consumer Financial Protection Bureau?, checking your credit score

One of your “STEPS TO GET AND KEEP A GOOD CREDIT SCORE” is “GET YOUR FREE CREDIT REPORT EVERY YEAR.”  In it, you state, “Tip: You don’t have to buy your credit score. The information you receive from the agencies is adequate.”

However, the document title of another of your public documents is,“Consumer Advisory: Check your credit score at least once a year.”  You can find that title in the properties of the document by opening it and using Ctrl+D, by performing a right click and choosing Document Properties, or by using File then Properties in the menu of a PDF reader.

Even the internet address of the document (http://files.consumerfinance.gov/f/201207_cfpb_consumer-advisory_check-your-credit-score-every-year.pdf) contains the same message.  But the word score does not even exist in the document content itself.  Despite the file name, document title and internet web address, if you perform a word search for “scor” within the document that is displayed, there are no matches.

On July 16, somebody in your organization wrote, “Read our consumer advisory on checking your credit score at least once a year.”  That message is signed “CFPB Web Team.”  What is the name of the person who is the head of that team?

If your advice is to check our credit scores once a year, then which one should we check?  And, how much does it cost citizens to do so?

And, answer last month’s questions today.  You are falling behind.

—
Greg Fisher
The Credit Scoring Site
creditscoring.com
PO Box 342
Dayton, Ohio  45409-0342